Should undocumented immigrants have a “path to citizenship”?
says doctorwho1011 on Sep 5th 17 (#814087)
If they are here for the right reasons then yes.
says Tiffanee on Sep 5th 17 (#2648257)
Some of Americans best and most productive citizens were once undocumented immigrants.
says Tiffanee on Sep 5th 17 (#2648264)
In Canada .... Absolutely No
says SynysterGates on Sep 5th 17 (#2648261)
If you reward people for breaking the law, you will get a lot more people breaking the law. If the surest road to becoming an American is to simply sneak into the US, that's the route most people will take.
The solution to Mexico's problems is not for the population of the country to move to the US. In fact, if everyone with any ambition is encouraged to migrate away, it's bad for a country. So, at least some of the blame for Mexico's problem rests with those in the US who have been encouraging people from Mexico to come to the US to find a better future. It would be better for Mexico if Mexicans who want a better future pursued their dreams in Mexico.
says Maze on Sep 5th 17 (#2648263)
Generally, I agree with you. However, the Dream Act applies to children who were brought here by their parents illegally. They had no choice in the matter. So, after being here X number of years, paying to educate them, possibly as far as college or professional schools, now we are going to return them to a country with which they have little to no connection.
says Linnster on Sep 5th 17 (#2648272)
I don't like it, but I don't see a better solution either. If people know their kids can stay, it's a powerful incentive to come to the US illegally and have kids. If they know that their kids will be sent back too, that incentive is gone.
Mexico is such a beautiful place, it could be heaven on earth, but the only thing that can bring that about is the people.
says Maze on Sep 5th 17 (#2648363)
It isn't an easy problem to solve, but we're going to have to do something. I understand your argument and agree with the incentive issue, but I also think it's not really fair to deport kids who have been here almost their entire lives, who go to college, go into professions, have jobs. open businesses, choose to go into the military and in general benefit this country rather than take from it.
says Linnster on Sep 6th 17 (#2648368)
If they're such skilled, productive, beneficial people, isn't it selfish to keep them in the US rather than returning them to their home country where those skills and that ambition could be put to use improving life for everyone there?
says Maze on Sep 6th 17 (#2648378)
You have to remember that these were people who were brought here by their parents at young ages. They have no real connection with their home countries after being here for such a long time. Wouldn't it be a shame to have invested so much money in their educations to have them leave?
says Linnster on Sep 6th 17 (#2648400)
I'd be surprised if existing "dreamers" get sent home anyway, more likely the program will just stop adding new people. The bottom line is though, it incentivizes illegal immigration, and anything you incentivize, you encourage more of. Do you want more illegal immigration? Throw out incentives.
What I want for Mexico, and the rest of the countries to the south, is that they be safe, prosperous places to live, where the people are happy and don't want to leave, except maybe to go on vacation. It could be paradise, it should be paradise, that's the real problem, illegal immigration is just a symptom, that's what people should be focusing on if they want to fix it.
says Maze on Sep 6th 17 (#2648422)
I hear you. The countries from whom these people are coming are dangerous because of drug cartels and gangs. It's hard for us to do away with gangs here so it's probably even harder in these banana republics where the police and leaders are as corrupt as can be.
Remember that this country was built by immigrants. If the Irish, Italians, Jews and others didn't come to have a better life, we wouldn't be a super power. Yes, they came legally - I get that, but the problem is that the government has failed to enforce the immigrations laws we do have. Presidents have declared amnesty and allowed illegal aliens to remain here and given them a path to citizenship. You can't blame people for wanting a chance for a better life.
As for incentivizing more to come here illegally, that can easily be stopped by denying them any benefits - no Section 8 housing, no food stamps, no welfare, no nothing and start fining the companies that hire them.
says Linnster on Sep 6th 17 (#2648435)
"... these banana republics where the police and leaders are as corrupt as can be..."
They are corrupt because they were corrupted by elements within the US. They can't not be corrupt, honest leaders are assassinated or overthrown, it's how the system works. It's repugnant to behold, but that's the root cause of the problem and it will only get worse until it's solved.
Here is a very brief and concise description of the true source of the illegal immigration problem, as described by a former insider: a self described "economic hitman".
says Maze on Sep 6th 17 (#2648463)
Well, if this is true, then the people who are fleeing their country to come here cannot make their own countries better, so we're back to square one.
Added: And, if these countries have been corrupted by OUR government, then aren't we in effect responsible for those people who are fleeing the corruption and violence and coming here?
says Linnster on Sep 6th 17 (#2648492)
This is an area where there is room for cooperation between people on all sides of the political spectrum. Because, regardless of political ideology, not too many people look kindly on that kind of abuse. And the effects are things all sides rage against: illegal immigration, the drug war, corruption, government overreach, foreign wars, the police state, the prison industry, they're all part of the same problem. The swamp runs DEEP. That's why they want everyone at each other's throats, they fear what might happen if the public get together.
says Maze on Sep 6th 17 (#2648511)
I can't disagree with that. The entire issue is not black and white and will not be easy to fix. Trump is right about one thing - it is Congress' job to enact immigration status laws. It should not be done by executive orders which can be overridden by a subsequent administration.
says Linnster on Sep 6th 17 (#2648513)
Linn, The flip side of that is, after being here so many years, where American Citizens have been supporting them, suffering from their gangs and criminal activities, over burdening the taxpayer at every turn and never facing being held accountable, I'd say we would be a head to send them back. Many which have been here almost their entire lives, still don't speak English. (In some states, it is mandated that they be taught in Spanish.... another taxpayer expense)
says JustJimColo on Sep 7th 17 (#2649118)
I would agree that the parents have not always assimilated by learning English, but I don't think that applies to their children. I also believe that there are any number of legal immigrants who come here and never learn English. They gravitate to neighborhoods where there are a majority of their own and remain insulated their entire lives. Do I think this is right? No, but it is what it is.
says Linnster on Sep 7th 17 (#2649153)
The DREAM Act never passed.
says Budwick on Sep 13th 17 (#2652996)
Wasn't it by Executive Order? What Trump is saying is that if Congress wants the DREAM Act to continue, they should codify it by enacting it into law.
says Linnster on Sep 13th 17 (#2653022)
And you're right, DACA was an executive order that went far beyond Obama's legal limitations. No one had the gnads to question Obama at the time. (He was black you know!) But, everyone can take a shot at Trump!
So, when the media got wind he was going to address DACA, it became time to cue the racist anti-everything movement cuz Trump wants to correct a problem. He gave the illegals and Congress fair warning - pass a law that takes care of this within 6 months - or DACA is gone.
Well played if you ask me.
says Budwick on Sep 13th 17 (#2653031)
I don't object to what Trump is trying to accomplish, I don't care for the way he went about it. Instead of using an elephant gun to kill a mosquito, he could have said that this was in Congress' hands to begin with and not stirred up all sorts of anxiety. He needs to stop being all brash and blustery only to back down to a more moderate position which is what he ultimately did.
says Linnster on Sep 13th 17 (#2653038)
Linn - Trump brought it up and handed it off to Congress in one fluid movement.
You're reacting to the media reaction.
says Budwick on Sep 13th 17 (#2653053)
I guess you didn't hear all his posturing at the campaign rallies he's attended since he became president, but I won't let what I saw and heard get in the way of how you interpreted his bluster. You are entitled to your opinion.
says Linnster on Sep 13th 17 (#2653058)
I don't recall Trump mentioning making a deal with Pelosi during any of his rallies. But mentioning the rallies in very general terms is a grand way to deflect a direct response.
says Budwick on Sep 14th 17 (#2653355)
Some should and some shouldn't. How that gets decided should be made into law, not by a President's executive order. If it was done right the first time a new President couldn't just overturn it with another signature. Congress needs to do their jobs.
says Will_Janitor on Sep 5th 17 (#2648276)
Isn't that the truth? I don't find it humane to uproot people who have been granted amnesty under another administration and send them back to their countries of origin if they are upstanding citizens who have done nothing illegal.
says Linnster on Sep 5th 17 (#2648284)
Congress has 6 months to do something about it. All Trump did was stop additional people from signing up.
says Will_Janitor on Sep 5th 17 (#2648292)
If Congress decides to go with what Trump and Sessions want, then those people are up the creek without a paddle.
says Linnster on Sep 5th 17 (#2648293)
I don't know what Trump and Sessions want. I only know what they do.
says Will_Janitor on Sep 5th 17 (#2648294)
Sessions wants to end DACA and, probably, deport all illegals. Trump changes is tune from one day to the next.
says Linnster on Sep 5th 17 (#2648296)
You must know Sessions on a personal basis so I will defer. Trump did end DACA. All it took was a signature because that is all it took to start it. He has given congress 6 months to make a law or not.
says Will_Janitor on Sep 5th 17 (#2648303)
No, I don't know Sessions, just what I read in the news, wherein he says he wants DACA ended. Immigration and Naturalization are federal regulations and should be codified by laws enacted by Congress and not Executive Orders issues by presidents.
says Linnster on Sep 5th 17 (#2648317)
I agree. I haven't seen anything about rounding people up for deportation from this group or the other 12 million illegal aliens/undocumented people. If I do, I will certainly express my opinion at that time.
says Will_Janitor on Sep 5th 17 (#2648329)
says StarzAbove on Sep 5th 17 (#2648319)
Generally, no, but in extraordinary circumstances an Act of Congress, signed by the President would be a law and I'd be fine with that.
says Billyreyn on Sep 5th 17 (#2648322)
Who has been paying for dreamers and at what expense to the American family? When they get on TV and start spouting how they deserve to be here all I can think of is how many Americans sacrifice their own dreams to pay taxes so that these dreamers can get a free ride.
If people want to come here to work, great, but no one gets free anything at the expense of the taxpayers. When the Statue of Liberty was put in the harbor no one was getting freebie anything.
says ozzyboy on Sep 5th 17 (#2648362)
They are ALL criminals. We have enough criminals in this country without continuing to import more.
says JustJimColo on Sep 7th 17 (#2649116)
illegal aliens have proven themselves criminals while legal immigrants are law abiding we need more lawful Americans
says shinrin on Sep 7th 17 (#2649164)
Yeah why not if they try hard enough to be a true American
says Jaxxi on Sep 13th 17 (#2652665)
The path to citizenship already exists.
It's called legal immigration.
says Budwick on Sep 13th 17 (#2652999)